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#121 Chambolle

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 09:24 PM

Well, in the short term, this cashless business thing is headed for a legislated halt in many jurisdictions ... google and you will see

 

With the caveat that I haven't looked at prior pages of this thread and I only quickly skimmed what people wrote on this page .... hence I may not be totally in context ... but the following needs to be said ...

 

eta - sorry in advance, Bonner ... but you, more than most, know that Chambo is on-point

 

The fully unbanked in the US is MANY millions of households ... and when you look at certain states, you may be very surprised about the magnitude of some of the numbers. Just google "unbanked in the US" and focus on FED reporting cuz that's real data. And then reflect upon the fact that the US is (one of) the wealthiest country in the world

 

Further, the debit cards that are being heavily marketed to these unbanked communities and that have achieved substantial market share have egregious fees for actual usage patterns ... when all is said and done, these are loanshark-like, predatory businesses ... and it's such a real issue that the CFPB is issuing rules to address the situation ... and if you read some of the details in the below link, these requirements are obviously being put in place because these communities are being taken to the cleaners ... and it's wrong and it sickens me ...but people in general just don't understand money and how to handle their finances prudently and don't seem to care and don't truly educate themselves* ... and I'm now talking about most people at ALL economic levels and it's also true for many big corporations ... and if there are people who are ready, willing and able to be imprudent in this department, you can be sure that faster than you can count to three that there will be a sky filled with vultures to pick at any and everything left unattended ... and that's why we have the MASSIVE financial industry that we do today who very happily and cluelessly and greedily sunk the US economy a decade ago ... of course, with the help of this overall imprudent populace ... and yes, let's not forget the regulators and politicians too ... a total societal breakdown ... but thankfully we all learned from all this, right ? ... because our country's books are pretty close to balanced ... or NOT !

 

Listen up ... this may take some time, but stuff is SO out of control right now and it's an ultra-serious subject that is pretty much completely off the radar ... and let me be crystal clear as I look into my crystal ball a handful of years out ... SCARY TIMES ! VERY SCARY TIMES !

 

https://www.nclc.org...-card-rule.html

 

 

* which, I agree, is VERY difficult to do because there is a giant, self-interested, conflicted, wealthy-beyond-any-sound-reason finance industry that all in harmony and all in concert endlessly chant lies and half-truths until they're believed to be true, deceives deceives deceives, confuses confuses confuses and then there's the clueless co-opted press and their clueless reporting on this stuff that just parrots what the fat financial cats (who are very slick and very articulate and very well-dressed and very well-groomed and very personable and seem very, very helpful, I might add) want them to say ... which is that this financial stuff is way too complicated and way too important for you to handle yourself so let us sweet, little fat cats do it for you ... and help you get in and get out when appropriate .,, and sell you funds with nice fees (maybe when coming, maybe when going, maybe all along during the ride) ... and sell you funds / products that have "no fees" but actually do ... and will package up some nice, tidy offerings for you to peruse ... blah blah effing blah ... I could go on for days on this subject ... and I know of what I speak ... but here's the thing, many here among us might be kinda sorta nodding along but saying to themselves "Chambo's kinda right, but this doesn't apply to me, cuz I do have my act together" ... because that's human nature ... but do you really ? ... and this applies so much to so many very smart folks ... think doctors, lawyers and even financial industry folks themselves !!! ... and it's all because they do NOT want to be "average" and get "average" returns because they consider themselves way above average ... just go note average per capita US income ... and yes, many here may well be well above average ... so why settle for the average returns of those unwashed masses ... and that's human nature too

 

And the problem is that it's extremely difficult for the truth to get out ... because the truth is a very lonely voice in the wilderness ... drowned out by the monstrous resources of the financial industry marketing and PR machinery and the press who eats it up and spits it out, no questions asked ...

 

I'm going to go back to being silly and unhinged now ... cuz that's the Chambo brand and that's the way I like it 



#122 Sneakeater

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 09:25 PM

DITTO DITTO DITTO.

 

Thanks for that.


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#123 joethefoodie

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 10:09 PM

and it's such a real issue that the CFPB is issuing rules to address the situation ... 

 

I certainly appreciate that you're alluding to the CFPB.

 

And I could tell you some stories about what really is going on at the CFPB under Mulvaney Kraninger.

 

Off the record, of course.



#124 voyager

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 10:13 PM

Psst, there's nobody around.   


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not my monkeys.


#125 Wilfrid

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 11:19 PM

I would be interested in a comparison between the cost of using prepaid debit cards from the well known high street suppliers, and the costs associated with credit cards.

#126 Anthony Bonner

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 11:26 PM

Like a credit card w/o revolving? Much cheaper even if it's a secured subprime card.

But you need a bank account to get even that.

"This is a battle of who blinks first, and we've cut off our eyelids"


#127 Anthony Bonner

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 11:27 PM

Also because a credit card is a lending product there are usually tighter regs.

"This is a battle of who blinks first, and we've cut off our eyelids"


#128 Wilfrid

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 11:55 PM

Are you including interest?

#129 Orik

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 11:59 PM

The fair comparison is with credit cards paid in full monthly, so there's no interest. Then the cost of good cards is substantially negative.


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#130 Anthony Bonner

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 12:04 AM

Right. Tho I'd guess the person considering the prepaid debit card is at best underbanked and unable to get a good card.

"This is a battle of who blinks first, and we've cut off our eyelids"


#131 Anthony Bonner

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 12:05 AM

Also and this is just being pedantic, you're paying interest on a prepaid debit card - at least if rates are normal.

"This is a battle of who blinks first, and we've cut off our eyelids"


#132 Wilfrid

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 12:09 AM

And the person with income insecurity is vulnerable to missing payments.

I know I posted before but I just looked again, and standard high street prepaid debit card is $2.50 for cash reload, $1.50 for transactions, $3 for ATM withdrawals.

I thought the reload used to be a percentage of the deposit; if so things have got better. These businesses are trying to stack them high and sell them cheap, not set rates their market can’t afford. (I am sure there are predators out there.)

Of course there is a bigger social problem if all transactions go digital, I am not minimizing that.

#133 Chambolle

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 12:12 AM

the costs associated with credit cards.

 

My credit cards PAY ME to use them ... either in miles or 2% cash back ... zero annual fee in year 1 and $95 per year thereafter ... but you can play the credit card game and cancel after a year

 

Just got a new United card sent to me in NJ*  to start playing the credit card game. Spent $2k already and boom 40k bonus miles. I never pay a cent in interest or charges or nuttin ... ever ... and if there's a hiccup somehow ... I call and the charge is always reversed

 

This is why the US is on credit cards and China is on Alipay.

 

In the US, a large amount of the overall spend (I'm guessing here ... don't know the numbers) receives BENEFITS by using a credit card ... not to mention the MAJOR  security aspect of funds not leaving your account when you use a card. The credit card company handed money over to the merchant ... not you ! And I never have to worry about such fraud

 

 

* but after I kept asking Mom is my card here ... is my card here ... I finally called and found out that my card arrived and had a $950 balance already ... only problem is that I never received the card ... the card was either stolen from my Mom's mailbox or the mailman is involved with evil things and so card 2 was Fedexed to NYC just in the nick of time ... and it's the bank's problem to deal with the $950 out the window, not mine. And he who has the money wins ... and when it is out of your account, it's a major hassle of time and frustration to get it back



#134 Chambolle

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 12:14 AM

They don't cost me ... they PAY ME ... with an always on 2% discount on whatever I buy ! 

 

But this is a different segment of the overall market ... I know



#135 Anthony Bonner

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 12:14 AM

That's hideously expensive for a secured product. The returns on prepaid debit cards are preposterous. Think about it this way - do you pay any of those fees on your debit card? The cost of running a prepaid debit card is way less than your bank account and yet you don't pay that.

"This is a battle of who blinks first, and we've cut off our eyelids"