Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Except that all identical twins I personally know are mirror images of each other. One left handed, one right. One creative, one mechanical. So you would have same DNA but not proclivities of right brain left brain, right?

No. You are assuming that lateralization of brain function is independent of handedness but language lateralization, for example, is often switched in left handed people. And if you were correct that identical twins tended to opposites of behaviour, then concordance for schizophrenia would be lower in identical than in fraternal twins. But your anecdotal evidence is not born out by the Minnesota twins study which has shown that a broad range of behavioural traits are shared by identical twins, even when reared apart.

 

Edit: It is, however, an interesting question as to why handedness is often opposite in identical twins. It appears to be related to whether the zygote split before or after the onset of lateralization.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 183
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

so i had a couple of healing conversations with my students today about the circumstances of the shooting. i let them know in no uncertain terms that they should have no expectation, should something like this happen here, that i will throw my body in front of the gun to buy them escape time. they seemed soothed.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Seriously, I find this all very fascinating. The Brain and Behavior. I tend to lean toward the cultural nurture school, but I've worked in the DNA field long enough to know the impact of genetics. And, yes, Yvonne, parents were blamed for things beyond their control, sadly. But today it may have gone too far over in the opposite direction, especially in the areas of sexual identification modeling. The Virginia Tech guy was off the bell curve for anti-social behavior. A really damaged person. But he seethed and raged. The Columbine kids appeared more towards getting locked into D&D alter egos for fun, as mentioned here earlier. I know a four year old whose parents have been asked to remove him from nursery school and get counseling for his inability to feel remorse. A wire disconnected about two years ago. When the parents separted for several months. Is he redeemable? Time will tell.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Since married couples in our society are - more or less - as likely to get divorced as not (separation rate among unmarried couples likely higher), while only a very small minority of children exhibit the kinds of extreme anti-social behavior we have been gesturing at on this thread, you have every reason for optimism.

Link to post
Share on other sites

i wrote this twice and decided against posting it. anyways...here i am again because i think it's an important point for some serious chewing.

 

keeping my opinions to myself and only pasting relevant bits of another's voice. infer.

 

quoting arianna huffington:

 

Reports that Cho had been taking antidepressants once again turn the spotlight on the uneasy question of what role these powerful medications might have played in yet another campus massacre.

 

It's the same bloody-morning-after question I've been asking since 1998, when we learned 15-year old Oregon school shooter Kip Kinkel, who opened fire in his school cafeteria, had been on Prozac. Nearly ten years -- and numerous school-shooters-on-prescription-meds -- later, we're still waiting for answers.

 

Now let me make it perfectly clear that I am NOT saying that antidepressants are what caused Cho to go off the deep end and kill 32 people and then himself (indeed, school and law enforcement officials haven't yet disclosed what specific meds were found among his effects). And I'm NOT saying that there aren't thousands of people who benefit from such medication. What I AM saying is that it is absurd -- and incredibly irresponsible -- for our leaders, and our culture, not to be fully investigating the correlation between antidepressants and manic/suicidal behavior.

 

Despite disturbing evidence of drug-induced reactions, the number of children being given mood-altering drugs continues to soar. America now has over 8 million kids on such drugs.

 

Eli Lilly, the maker of Prozac, has vehemently denied numerous claims that the drug causes violent or suicidal reactions. But the company's own documents admit that "nervousness, anxiety, insomnia, inner restlessness (akathisia), suicidal thoughts, self mutilation, manic behavior" are among the "usual adverse effects" of the medication. And a clinical trial found that Prozac caused mania in 6 percent of the children studied.

 

Can there be any doubt that Cho was exhibiting many of these adverse effects during his reign of terror in Blacksburg? His rambling, multi-media diatribe seems like a textbook example of manic behavior. The question is, was his manic behavior purely the result of a sick mind or was drug-induced psychosis part of the toxic psychological mix?

 

We don't know. But we do know that one school shooter after another was on prescription drugs. Kip Kinkel was taking Prozac. Columbine killer Eric Harris was taking Luvox. Red Lake Indian Reservation shooter Jeff Weise was taking Prozac. James Wilson, who shot 2 elementary school kids in Greenwood, South Carolina, was taking anti-depressants. Conyers, Georgia school shooter T.J. Solomon was on ritalin. Is this just a coincidence?

 

Again, we don't know. But here are some of the questions we need answers to:

 

1. It's been reported by the New York Times that Cho was on prescription medications. Which ones? Who prescribed them? How long had he been taking them?

 

2. If the drugs were prescribed when he was admitted to the New River Community Services center near Virginia Tech in December 2005, which doctor kept refilling his prescriptions? And what was the diagnosis?

 

3. What kind of medical and/or psychological follow-up was there? Or was Cho one of the many people put on antidepressants without a thorough and ongoing monitoring of the results and side effects?

 

i am guessing xanax withdrawal.

Link to post
Share on other sites

J Kim-Cohen, A Caspi, A Taylor, B Williams, R Newcombe, I W Craig, T E Moffitt. MAOA, maltreatment, and gene–environment interaction predicting children's mental health: new evidence and a meta-analysis Molecular Psychiatry (2006) 11, 903–913.

 

Previous research on adults has shown that a functional polymorphism in the promoter region of the monoamine oxidase A (MAOA) gene moderates the impact of childhood maltreatment on risk for developing antisocial behavior. Thus far, attempts to replicate this finding have been mixed. The current study (i) presents new data investigating this finding in a sample of 975 seven-year-old boys, and (ii) evaluates the extant data by conducting a meta-analysis of published findings. We replicated the original finding by showing that the MAOA polymorphism moderates the development of psychopathology after exposure to physical abuse, we extended the finding to childhood closer in time to the maltreatment experience, and we ruled-out the possibility of a spurious finding by accounting for passive and evocative gene–environment correlation. Moreover, meta-analysis demonstrated that across studies, the association between maltreatment and mental health problems is significantly stronger in the group of males with the genotype conferring low vs high MAOA activity. These findings provide the strongest evidence to date suggesting that the MAOA gene influences vulnerability to environmental stress, and that this biological process can be initiated early in life.

Emphasis added.

Link to post
Share on other sites
What I AM saying is that it is absurd -- and incredibly irresponsible -- for our leaders, and our culture, not to be fully investigating the correlation between antidepressants and manic/suicidal behavior.

And what makes Arianna think that the correlation is not being investigated? For example what about the

 

clinical trial [that] found that Prozac caused mania in 6 percent of the children studied.

 

Now let me make it perfectly clear that I am NOT saying that antidepressants are what caused Cho to go off the deep end and kill 32 people and then himself

But you are strongly implying that antidepressents are what caused Cho to go off the deep end.

 

But we do know that one school shooter after another was on prescription drugs. Kip Kinkel was taking Prozac. Columbine killer Eric Harris was taking Luvox. Red Lake Indian Reservation shooter Jeff Weise was taking Prozac. James Wilson, who shot 2 elementary school kids in Greenwood, South Carolina, was taking anti-depressants. Conyers, Georgia school shooter T.J. Solomon was on ritalin. Is this just a coincidence?
Link to post
Share on other sites

quoting arianna huffington: <snip>

To me this is a set of nonsensical rhetorical questions given to try to establish blame. The trap with cases like this is that many make an attempt to establish a very simple causal relationship (kid is disturbed/doctor prescribes pills/pills make him murder students) when what drives someone to this state likely has many layers of complexity and interconnection.

 

It may be quite interesting to understand what the research shows with regard to mania and prescription anti-depressants. It might also be interesting to have an honest discussion about possible holes we might have in the research done to date. But Ms. Huffington doesn't seem to have that on her mind with the written line of questioning.

Link to post
Share on other sites

the worst school mass murder happened in 1927 (bath school in central michigan), way before anti-depressants or video games.

To be strictly accurate, the Bath incident was not a serial shooting. Bombings, IMHO, call for a different psychology than that required to aim a gun & pull the trigger repeatedly at a large number of individual human beings one after another over a period of time.

Link to post
Share on other sites

It pisses me off that he got what he wanted, because every other on-the-edge narcissist gets to see once again how well this blaze of glory shit works. His moronic manifesto and his wanking pictures, all over the news.

Link to post
Share on other sites

J Kim-Cohen, A Caspi, A Taylor, B Williams, R Newcombe, I W Craig, T E Moffitt. MAOA, maltreatment, and gene–environment interaction predicting children's mental health: new evidence and a meta-analysis Molecular Psychiatry (2006) 11, 903–913.

 

Previous research on adults has shown that a functional polymorphism in the promoter region of the monoamine oxidase A (MAOA) gene moderates the impact of childhood maltreatment on risk for developing antisocial behavior. Thus far, attempts to replicate this finding have been mixed. The current study (i) presents new data investigating this finding in a sample of 975 seven-year-old boys, and (ii) evaluates the extant data by conducting a meta-analysis of published findings. We replicated the original finding by showing that the MAOA polymorphism moderates the development of psychopathology after exposure to physical abuse, we extended the finding to childhood closer in time to the maltreatment experience, and we ruled-out the possibility of a spurious finding by accounting for passive and evocative gene–environment correlation. Moreover, meta-analysis demonstrated that across studies, the association between maltreatment and mental health problems is significantly stronger in the group of males with the genotype conferring low vs high MAOA activity. These findings provide the strongest evidence to date suggesting that the MAOA gene influences vulnerability to environmental stress, and that this biological process can be initiated early in life.

Emphasis added.

So it's both. Damned if ya do, damned if ya don't. Anyone do studies of prozac vs the paddle?

Link to post
Share on other sites

It pisses me off that he got what he wanted, because every other on-the-edge narcissist gets to see once again how well this blaze of glory shit works. His moronic manifesto and his wanking pictures, all over the news.

Yeah, almost makes me long for more Anna Nicole coverage/uncoverage.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...