Steroids? Knock me down!

[Robert Schonfeld]

Jaywalking is most definitely a competitive sport, and a real fun one at that. I would do it competitively for a four-year $125 million deal, with appropriate incentives for more, of course.

 

The records will have to stand because MLB and the Players Union failed to enforce the rules. They are, after all, the rules. If the players who used are caught or admit to it, they should be punished. if there is ever a rule that says it's ok to use whatever you want to enhance your performance, then that will be the rule. Whether there should be such a rule is another discussion.

[ngatti]

What is the incentive to testify truthfully before a Grand Jury if said testimony is going to be leaked to the press.

[Miguel Gierbolini]

What is the incentive to testify truthfully before a Grand Jury if said testimony is going to be leaked to the press.

To avoid perjury prosecution, maybe?

[hollywood]

What is the incentive to testify truthfully before a Grand Jury if said testimony is going to be leaked to the press.

To avoid perjury prosecution, maybe?

Rare. Very rare.

[ngatti]

It has always been my impression that Grand Jury testimony was sancrosanct. Was Giambi offered any immunity deal for his cooperation? Was the understanding that his testimony would remain in the Grand Jury room? In the aftermath of the leaks why would anyone want to testify? Plead the Fifth and tell all to bugger off.

 

Can you plead the Fifth to a Grand Jury? Maybe the lawyers amongst us can help.

[hollywood]

You're not entitled to a lawyer IN the Grand Jury room but you can talk to one before or after. It's supposed to be sacrosanct absent a court order. I believe you can take the Fifth but that has a way of being leaked. Of course, the surest way to get indicted by the Grand Jury is to take the Fifth. IIRC, Sinatra avoided Grand Jury testimony by dodging a subpena and hanging out in international waters/other countries until the prosecutor moved on to other things.

[Rail Paul]

The AP reports that Giambi has been invited to the Baseball Commissioners office to discuss the issue. Brian Cashman says he can't discuss the matter. There's speculation the Yankees would like to void the remaining term (3 years?) of Giambi's contract.

 

Sheffield is a bit different, in that the Yankees aren't interested in unloading him, and he's maintained he was unaware of the illicit nature of the goods.

[Robert Schonfeld]

Sheffield is a bit different, in that the Yankees aren't interested in unloading him, and he's maintained he was unaware of the illicit nature of the goods.

It looks as if ignorance of the substance and its effects is going to be Bonds' defense as well. That should be interesting.

[mongo_jones]

i have to say i don't know that steroids help bonds make contact with the ball as often and accurately as he does. of course they help send the ball further.

 

as for mcgwire, i am convinced he retired early to avoid being caught.

 

this would all be solved if people would just play cricket. wait, there's doping in cricket too now. at least, all the pitchers would be disqualified for chucking.

[Robert Schonfeld]

i have to say i don't know that steroids help bonds make contact with the ball as often and accurately as he does.

Probably not. A player can be great contact hitter without drugs. But the man holds the most famous record in American sport. He's a hero to millions of kids. If he got there using banned substances, that's bad in so many ways.

[g.johnson]

at least, all the pitchers would be disqualified for chucking.

That's allowed now.

[Rail Paul]

i have to say i don't know that steroids help bonds make contact with the ball as often and accurately as he does.

Probably not. A player can be great contact hitter without drugs. But the man holds the most famous record in American sport. He's a hero to millions of kids. If he got there using banned substances, that's bad in so many ways.

It's all very sad. Kids used to hang around outside the clubhouse to get autographs, now players sell them for $10 or more. Good natured fun (Mantle, Martin, Ford, for example) and clubbing was more or less innocent, and offset by Jackie Robinson, Yogi Berra, with their families at church.

 

And, Sandy Koufax famously declining to play on days of religious observance.

 

Gone to that same nostalgia as the the fifteen cent subway ride, the $2 ticket at Shea, lunch Schrafft's, Longchamp's, or the Automat

[hollywood]

Say it ain't so, Jason, Barry, Sammy, Mark, et al.

[mongo_jones]

i have to say i don't know that steroids help bonds make contact with the ball as often and accurately as he does.

Probably not. A player can be great contact hitter without drugs. But the man holds the most famous record in American sport. He's a hero to millions of kids. If he got there using banned substances, that's bad in so many ways.

well, i think he and, any others, should be stripped of any records achieved after proof of drug use (that is to say from the date at which it is proven they'd begun to take steroids). my point was only that bonds was a great player who enhanced one aspect (howsoever disproprtionately celebrated) of his game. this is qualitatively different for me from a case like that of ben johnson's: all the 100 metre sprint involves is running very fast; on the other hand, it could be argued that by expanding to near-mutant levels bonds and giambi hurt other aspects of their games.

 

but file all this under "hair-splitting"

[Robert Schonfeld]

it could be argued that by expanding to near-mutant levels bonds and giambi hurt other aspects of their games.

 

but file all this under "hair-splitting"

More important, I think, they hurt The Game.